“EARN the right to AUTOMATE!” — Toyota UK’s Paul Blahyj | Lean Made Simple
Paul Blahyj is a coach at the Toyota Lean Management Centre.
In this episode, Ryan Tierney and Matthew Thompson from Lean Made Simple ask him about:
How he went from professional ice hockey to making doors at Toyota
Working his way up from the factory floor to a senior leadership position
Internally promoting vs externally hiring
Why Toyota relies so much on paper over digital systems
Earning the right to automated
Why the term “low-skilled labourer” makes no sense
And how Toyota can help take your lean journey to the next level.
Check it out!
Links:
Book a visit to Toyota here: https://tlmcshop.toyotauk.com/collections/our-courses
Connect with Paul on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/paul-blahyj-8a3381258/
Ryan’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ryan-tierney-6237a8199/
Welcome to Lean Made Simple: a podcast for people who want to change their business and their lives one step at a time. I’m Ryan Tierney from Seating Matters, a manufacturing company from Limavady, Northern Ireland that employs 60+ people. Almost ten years ago, I came across this thing called “lean” and it transformed my life… now I want to share this message with as many people as possible.
This podcast unpacks our learnings, lessons and principles developed over the last decade in a fun, conversational way that will hopefully empower you on your own business journey — whether you’ve been doing lean for years or are just starting out!
Check it out on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Podcasts or any other podcast platform by searching “lean made simple.”
Thanks and all the best.
— Ryan Tierney
Magic Moment 1: "If the leaders don't do it, you ain't got a chance"
Magic Moment 2: "Robots Can Never Replace Humans" - Toyota UK's Paul Blahyj
Magic Moment 3: The Continuous IMPROVEMENT Journey is FOREVER
Full Transcription of Episode
LMS - Paul Blahyj Toyota
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Paul: [00:00:00] We build 600 vehicles a day.
Every time that person builds a vehicle they can look for improvements. We can't do that with machines. Equipment will do what you ask it to do.
It won't improve that situation.
Introduction and Welcome
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Ryan: Welcome to Lean Made Simple, a podcast for people who want to transform their business and their lives one step at a time.
Today we're at TMUK and
we've got the chance to sit down with Paul Blahyj, a lean manufacturing coach with TMUK.
Paul Blahyj's Journey to Toyota
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Ryan: How did you end up at Toyota? What, what's your story?
Paul: Ah, well, yeah, so I've been, uh, Toyota just over 26 years now. I played ice hockey as a kid.
And I kind of went to play professional ice hockey till I was 20.
Um, and then I met my... Uh, wife to be, uh, the money wasn't so good. Uh, so I decided to finish at 20 and, uh, look for a job elsewhere.
I started off here as a, as an operator on the shop floor. On door line where we made doors moved around the shop.
Toyota like to do that to kind of get your skill set. So I kind of stayed as a member for 10 years or so.
And then Toyota to do what Toyota to do in terms of how they develop the people,[00:01:00] they moved me into a project role. where I was in charge of designing some processors, or my team was in charge of designing the processor for the Corolla launch into the assembly shop.
And then I also moved on after that into some, time and labor studies. So we'd go to some lines, do some time and labor some study to make the processors more efficient. Again, Toyota developed me as a person... as an individual, giving me some skills that I not had when I first started.
This job came up... just over 18 months ago, I'd never heard of where I'm working today, which is a TLMC, Toyota Lean Management Center, never heard of it. But when I looked at what type of thing it was doing, working with external companies, it's, it's really something that interested me. So I applied for the job, and luckily I ended up getting the job just September last year.
The Opportunities and Growth at ToyotaThe Importance of Interpersonal Connections at Toyota
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Matthew: So the Toyota has given you the opportunity to...
come in working on the floor, rise up to the leadership position your in today.
Paul: Yes. And I think, and again, it's kind of humbling, isn't it? If you really think back at,
26 years ago I was, I was doing this and never kind of, without sounding too corny, never in my wildest dreams would I be [00:02:00] dreaming of doing what I'm doing in this job.
It's, It's a privilege. you never come to work, look at the clock, you only look at the clock, you think, is that the time? Today's gone so fast.
So I think that's real good. It's a real good thing that you wake up looking forward to coming to work.
The Visual Path and Progression at Toyota
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Ryan: Something I really liked yesterday, and the last day we were here as well, was the path.
Everybody can see a very clear path within Toyota
for where they can go, and it's very visual.
Paul: If you want to progress, this company will progress you, they will develop you.
Every member has the opportunity. And again, working in some companies that I've been lucky enough to work in within the last year,
I'm not so sure that's everywhere. So if you, when you come in here, uh, as a member you know that your job is to build vehicles.
But as you progress through your career, little doors open.
for you to progress else where. You know, if you think of, I was employed, my wife put this application form in for me to get employed to build a car, I never thought I'd be stood up here like last week, stood in front of you guys and girls, uh, in the role I'm in coaching.
It's, when you think about it, it kind of, kind of, kind of [00:03:00] mind blowing, that every person who comes in the door has that opportunity. And I use the, the example I used with you yesterday, so our uh, executive vice president at TME, Marvin Cook. So he's the second highest guy in the whole of Europe. Started at Toyota Burnaston as an engineer.
He's progressed his way through the ranks. That's what this company does.
The Importance of Internal Promotion at Toyota
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Matthew: You said yesterday you were talking about the difference between internally promoting and externally hiring. Could you kind of let us peek behind the curtain and Toyota thinks about that?
Paul: Yeah, so in manufacturing, our strong preference is to develop our people.
To be leaders within our people. And what we mean by that, we're all about the culture, the Toyota way. And yes, in the past we've externally hired people, and there's been some very successful people who are still at the company. But there's also a proportion of those people who got externally hired into manufacturing roles who weren't so successful.
And the reason that is, in my opinion, is that the culture, they've not been through that culture. You know, I speak about, um, [00:04:00] if you're a member, and then you fast forward 20 years until you're managing people, I don't think they give you high fives or throw rose petals down, but when you're sitting in front of them talking about what their job is, they know you've done it.
And I think that really holds a lot of water. And I think, again, that's what we do. So to answer your question, yes, in the past we've externally hired into manufacturing, we still externally hire now into non manufacturing areas. But in manufacturing, our preference is to develop our people within in order to grow the business.
They've lived and breathed it however long they've been here. Why wouldn't you do that?
The Significance of 'Member' in Toyota
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Matthew: This is just an aside, but why do you call people that work here member
Paul: We've had a comment before, but it's kind of friendly, isn't it? You know, operators almost robotic, right? Member is a, it's a, it's a softer adjective.
It's a, it's something that people can relate to. Our managing director, Richard, is a member. And the guy or girl who's putting bolts into a, into a door on door line is a member. We're all one unit. We're all [00:05:00] one family. We all wear the same... work wear we're distinguished by a name. You know, you'll see, why do you know people's name?
You asked me earlier. Well, it's on, it's on here. If I'm going round and I glance, I'll try and remember. So next time I see him, I can have that hello and use that person's name. It's a really small thing, but it goes a long way. I always remember an old boss who remained nameless. And one day he'd say hello, and the next day he'd walk straight past you.
The day you walk straight past you, it makes you think, is the guy upset? Have I done something to upset him?
If you smile and say hello to everybody, It's only going to, it's only going to go a lot further than if you walk past them.
Ryan: Yeah, that's amazing.
The Balance Between Digitization and Manual Work
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Ryan: You said something yesterday that was really interesting.
You said, We have to earn the right to digitize. Could you maybe expand on that and what that means?
Paul: Yeah, so we're, we're flip flop between being the number one world's leading motor manufacturer and luckily we are in terms of sales. So we do digitize, of course we do. We haven't got slates and paper everywhere you look.
But we strongly believe part of [00:06:00] the territory is Genchi Genbutsu, go look, see, understand, consense and we believe by having a paper trail, that promotes that.
If we are sat, and in some businesses do, and you have everything electrified and everything's at a button and you can see all your business in front of you, that's great, but in experiences that I've seen in some businesses, you'll see a bit of a red on the screen.
They'll make a phone call and say what's going on. If we see some red on a screen, because we do have screens. We go out, let's go and talk to the people, let's understand what problem is, let's understand um, what support they require to, to solve the problems. So yes, you'll go into assembly as we saw yesterday, and there's big screens, and it's lots of noise, and it sounds like an amusement arcade, some people say.
But also, there's a really strong paper trail, because you can touch and you can feel, and it promotes conversation if you go to a board, and there's paper on the board. So that's kind of what I mean by um, earning the right to digitize. And in years to come, maybe, we'll be all digital. Um, and I know there's a strong push in certain sectors of business to go digital.
Yeah. We make a conscious decision at Toyota to stay [00:07:00] paperwork because it promotes. It kind of feeds the Toyota way. It's obviously working anyway. Yeah, I think so. I know so. Was I sounding too
Matthew: arrogant?
The Role of Automation in Toyota
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Matthew: So, see in terms of automation versus manual work, where is the balance there with Toyota? How does Toyota stand with that?
Paul: So, I think there's some process.
So, you look at our weld operation, it's very highly automated with robots. It's difficult to get a human to weld with efficiency and with quality. If you look at our paint shop, it's highly automated. They're spraying paints onto a vehicle. It's kind of, um, not so, not such the right thing to do to kind of get a human to do that in terms of...
Um, from a business perspective. But when we looked in assembly yesterday, one of you guys said, wow, there's a lot of people. Your people build vehicles. And I said to the person, I think I said it to you, Matt, I said, um, we have equipment. We have to have equipment in certain quarters. The thing with equipment is, equipment will do what you ask it to do.
It [00:08:00] won't improve that situation. If you put people on a process, they will look to improve the process. You can't, you can't buy that. So I suppose the answer to the question is if I've got people or we've got people on a process and they're building that process, we build 600 vehicles a day, 300 on per shift.
Every time that person builds a vehicle they can look for improvements. We can't do that with machines. Now, in time, maybe we'll progress and be more automated, but at this point in time, the right thing that we believe is let's get the people, because the people are the most important thing, and they'll get the process.
Matthew: Machines can't improve themselves
Ryan: Amazing.
The Humility and Continuous Improvement at Toyota
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Ryan: So, I read recently that Toyota isn't the best car manufacturer in the world, they're the best manufacturer in the world. And one of the things that really surprised us yesterday when we were walking around, we were just chatting about it last night, is the humility at every level of this organization.
Like, you were showing us things where you're still, you've still problems with, or things you're still working on that you haven't solved yet. [00:09:00] And you're really open about it. Where where does that humility come from?
Paul: I think it's, um, we speak about culture and again, we've had some conversations over the last couple of weeks.
We're a vast organization, so the way that we manage our culture is by talking about the people. Something as small as member. When you come into the company, um, you're not a number, you're Paul Blahyj member number 4, 4, 8, 4, you're a member. We're all members. When you are all, when we're all classed as a member, it's your start point.
And then you come with, uh, the workwear. Honestly speaking, this isn't compulsory to wear. There's nothing in our terms and conditions that say, all members must wear workwear. It's voluntary. Have you ever seen, did you see anybody who's not got it on? Nobody. Absolutely not. And that shows you're part of the, the culture here.
That's where humility comes in. You, you, you get it as soon as you step into the door. You know, one of the ladies last week, and again, I know we spoke about it yesterday, when you come into the assembly shop, the word this lady used was [00:10:00] intimidating. You can be intimidated by the sights, by the sounds, by the smells.
It engages all five of your senses. But you're a member, you've got one of these on, you're going out there with guys and girls who have been there years, and years, and years, and they make you feel welcome. It's all not to be get swept away by the tidal wave of humanity. Or humility, should I say. So that's kind of, uh, the answer to your question is, it's here.
And you get, you get pulled along with it. Hey, let's be honest and we'll talk about being honest and perfect. Of course we have people who leave because it's not for them. Car manufacturing isn't easy. Working shifts isn't easy. Working in an office environment, supporting car manufacturing, it isn't easy.
So yes, of course people leave. But the nine guys who work for us in this department have all been here 25 years plus. It's loyalty. It must hold some, some water somewhere. And again, the last thing I'll say on it is, remember when we went into assembly yesterday and I showed you those walls? The 15 to 19 year peoples who serve, the 20 to 25 years who people serve, [00:11:00] and the 25 to 30 years that people serve.
It's there for everybody to see, and that's how you're going to grow. And that itself should say, this is a good company to work for, because look how many people have been here for so long. Yeah.
The Efficiency and Skill of Toyota Workers
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Matthew: You guys do something really paradoxical, and I don't know if I understood this right yesterday, but did you say at one point that, you know, it's the leader's job to actually remove processes from the line, and in turn that removes the amount of people working on the line?
But then you don't just, like, maybe another company throw those people away, it's like, oh, we don't need you anymore, you then redeploy these people elsewhere.
Paul: So, one of the, um, we're here to improve, right? So part of the Toyota way is to continue to improve, to continuously kaizen. And we don't like to, um, We don't make people redundant as a company, okay?
We've never made anybody compulsory redundant at TMUK. But we've also got a business to run and part of our business is is efficiency, is cost saving. So we will have teams who will go to lines, and they'll study lines, and they'll do some work with the lines, so [00:12:00] we don't just do it kind of as a project group, doing it to a line.
We'll go to the line, work with the group to look at making processes more efficient, which will in turn, maybe throw up some additional headcount that we can redeploy to other areas that we need it. And a really good example of that is that we spoke about yesterday, the BRC, the Business Revenue Center.
That's growing so fast. So we've got to kind of get lots of experience over there because it's a new area. It's, it's okay for, to have some agency people there, but we need some real high skillset. You can't hire in skillset, so you have to look at what you've got within. So one of the ways that we look at getting some skill, uh, is by redeploying.
How do we redeploy it? Let's go to a process, let's do some study, let's make efficient. Mr. or Mrs. A can go into BRC and strengthen that organization.
Matthew: As a way to free up more people within the organization to go to where they're needed to go. Yes. That is crazy.
Paul: This isn't easy and it's not, it's not easy to do because as we evolve, we've been here 32 years now and the process become very efficient, very [00:13:00] efficient, very efficient.
And again, this all comes back to this cultural thing. You go to some SMEs, honestly speaking, and you'll do some kaizen opportunity, or they'll do some kaizen and opportunity within the business. This person knows that when that, they might be out of a job, right? So therefore, they're not going to be able to, they're not going to take part in this Kaizen process because they're going to be worried that they're not going to be able to pay the mortgage.
We know our people. The people know that when we come, okay, they might be redeployed, but they've got a job. And that's the kind of, again, it's, we keep talking about culture. It's one of these cultural things. You don't meet barriers when you go to that line to work with their people to make their processes efficient because they know they've got a job.
The Importance of Continuous Improvement
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Ryan: One of the questions I had before coming here two weeks ago was, because I've read it in all the books, all the, there's been thousands of books written on Toyota, and in all the books it says that every single person continuously improves, and I was like, do they really, do they actually improve? But you actually answered my question yesterday, when you said I think it's two Kaizans per month that every member has to do, and it is [00:14:00] unbelievable that every single person like it says in the books, every single person is.
They do have that Kaizen mindset. They're always looking for tiny, incremental improvements. And we've seen it happening yesterday. How do you encourage two and a half thousand people to come up with improvements every month?
Paul: It's a good question. So we, um, have what we call... Setting our people our expectation.
If you don't set expectation to people, you'll get some variable results back. So if I say to you three guys who are in front of me now, go Kaizen.
You might come back with five, you might come back with one, and this guy might say, I ain't got a clue what Kaizen is. If you say to the people, your job is to raise a minimum two Kaizen per month as members, your team leader, please coach these people.
And give the people the time and the opportunity to raise two Kaizens per month. And group leader, which is at my level, please give the team leader and coach the team leader time for the members to do these two Kaizans per month. [00:15:00] It's all three levels of the organization. It holds more water if the member knows that his team leader, or the lady knows that his team leader is going to be supporting them.
The group leader is going to support them and ultimately my boss will support me in that as well. So it's all about this kind of, this kind of layered confirmation, layered support system we have in place. And again, honestly speaking, at times it's difficult to get two and a half thousand people raise Kaizens.
Honestly speaking, will everybody raise two a month? Absolutely not. I'll be, I'll be lying and sitting here saying... But if you don't set the expectation of your minimum as you raise it to a point, two a month, you've not got no start point for development or coaching your people. All that said, that the vast majority of people raise a minimum to a month.
And that mindset's here, the challenge here, again, part of this Toyota Way. But if you don't set the expectation, you're only going to get a lower result than if you're setting none.
The Impact of Lean on Business Efficiency
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Matthew: You shared a really crazy stat yesterday about the number of people that work at Toyota versus other car manufacturers.
Are you able to share that?
Paul: I [00:16:00] can't share the car manufacturer, but because that'd be unfair, but we use possibly a third less people than one of our greatest rivals do to build similar vehicles. A similar number.
Ryan: A third less? That's crazy, isn't it?
Paul: And I think it's, it's the members. And then it's kind of like, uh, if you use an analogy of a football or soccer team, the football players are the ones who make it happen. When you interview football or soccer players, they talk about the tea lady in the tea room, right?It's part of the bigger team.
So the guys and girls who are building the car, of course they're the bread and butter. They're adding value to the business. But the support people. You know, when we went onto the shop floor yesterday where we went to the up and over kit that we'll see through your video, it was broken down. The members were there helping, but they had the guys who built that there with them, supporting them.
They don't just walk away. In some businesses, they'll build you a piece of equipment, I've gone, I'm going to move on to the next thing. Richard, the group leader in his team, was there yesterday supporting that member with an issue he had with equipment. [00:17:00] It's all back to that culture again. This person knows if something breaks...
Someone's going to come to help me and I'm not going to be left on my own. And that's kind of one of the many things that make you want to work here because you feel that people want to help.
Matthew: When you come over next month for the Lean Made Simple Tour, you'll meet this guy called Paddy. And Paddy's famous for doing the work of seven men in the woodworking department. I felt like yesterday I met about 20 Paddy's.
You know, like the dashboards, like the way the dashboards were being made. We sat and watched this one woman build for probably like 10 minutes and it was just like, boom, boom, boom. And then she'd click something with her foot and it flips around and you're just kind of like, this is so, so, so efficient.
It's, it's remarkable.
Paul: And you've got to think is again, it took a while for this penny to drop for me. These people... In their own way, are craftspeople. They know how to build a vehicle. Like, you look at them people yesterday. They're highly skilled individuals.
This lady who's, I saw her watching. She's, her hands are going like hummingbird's wings. But she's in control. She knows what she's doing. Of course, when she goes home, [00:18:00] she knows she's had a shift. Because it isn't easy, it isn't easy to build vehicles. But they're all there. They're committed. They want to do the best for the company.
again, I keep coming back to it. Probably over emphasize it, but it's part of this cultural thing that we have
The Role of Leadership in Implementing Lean
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Ryan: Paul, this has been unbelievable. The tour yesterday when I was here two weeks ago, my mind was absolutely blown.
I couldn't sleep last night. My head was going at 100 miles per hour.
Paul: I could tell that when you WhatsApp'd me at quarter past eleven.
Ryan: So,for somebody watching this, you know, Toyota and the TPS and the Toyota Way.... This, really complicated system. How can a business owner watching this implement these tools within their organization?
Paul: The most important part for me of implementing Lean into any business of any size is the leaders. If the leaders don't do it, you ain't got a chance. There's some really good strong organizations that we've got.
There's one down in South Wales. One of your friends, Oliver Conger, he's a managing director of the business. His people are bought into it because he's so enthusiastic about it.[00:19:00]
One thing that we see is people of leaders will say, I'm going to send 20 people on a course to Toyota, they'll do lean, they'll come back, I've ticked a box, I've done lean, and they'll leave it to it. So these people have been over here and they've lived and breathed it for a couple of days or five days, however long they come, and they go back really enthusiastic, because their boss hasn't been.
He or she, the boss, well, they've ticked this lean box, I'm just going to sit back and wait what happens. What happens then is that the people have no sense of direction. We're not setting that standard. We're not setting the expectation. They fall away because they've been on a course, enthusiastic, they think the boss don't care.
What does the boss do? This lean? I've sent them on a course, their not even doing it. I'm never going to bother with it. And that kind of, and you see that in, in so many businesses. So I suppose the short answer is the boss has got to believe, understand, drive, and support the organization to take them on the journey.
And not put them on a bus to come to Toyota, get back and expect it to be implemented, because it definitely won't be.
The Role of TLMC in Lean Implementation
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Ryan: Yeah, and I think that's why [00:20:00] TLMC is so powerful, because it's a 5 month program, isn't it?
Paul: So yeah, there's a number of programs at TLMC,
Toyota Lean Management Center So you can come...
On site and have some short term training and take that back into your business. And that comes at a lower level, uh, understanding of lean to kind of a developed level of lean,
And then we're looking at a course that's over a six month period where you have some interaction with Toyota coaches.
So you'll come onto this site, the vehicle plant in Derby or the engine plant in Deeside for three separate occasions. And then the coaches, the nine of us, will spend the time and we'll come into the organization and your organizations or the company's organizations for five separate visits. At the end of that then, through your start off the journey having a problem and working on a problem with the coach, at the end of it, you give some output presentation in terms of how you're going to take that into your business.
So it's okay being coached and being developed, but as a business you also want some output. Your output will then gauge where you've come as and where you're going. But most importantly, understand where you want to drive [00:21:00] your next focus in the business. Because lean never stops. I hate the phrase, we've done lean.
We've tried lean. Lean isn't a system, it's a culture for me. So people say, yeah, we've done lean. No, you've not. Lean is a continued journey forever. And again, this is only the first stepping stone of that lean journey, is the possibility of coming here to see us and us helping you.
Ryan: So if you're liking what you're hearing from Paul and you'd like to learn more about Lean or go on a deep dive on your Lean journey, I would really recommend clicking the link below and visit the TLMC website and implement Lean into your organization. I think it's such a powerful thing that you're doing Paul
Paul: Really good to have you here. Thank you.